Sunday, April 03, 2005

Bobov

R to L. Rabbi Shlomo Halberstam, Rabbi Ben Zion Halberstam, Rabbi Naftoli Halberstam. (Taken in the early 70's) Bobov is doomed. So are the other Chassidic dynasties and most probably Judaism in general. They are doomed because nothing good can come out from fights like these, which are uglier and nastier then two politicians fighting neck and neck of which we like to make so much fun of. I know that many people are hurting but I don’t. Although as someone who had witnessed from very close the succession fights that went on between the two holy brothers of Satmar while the father was and still is alive, I naturally do have an inclination to silently support one of the two that are claiming to be the true successor to the previous Rebbe of Bobov. However, it still delights me that the ones who supposedly hold Orthodoxy together are the ones who are ultimately destroying it. In short words for those of you who have no idea what I’m ranting about. Bobov is a sect or Chassidius that was re-founded in the US after being almost wiped out totally in Nazi Europe by Rabbi Shlomo Halberstam who built Bobov up from scratch after losing most of his family to the Nazis and their Galician helpers. The only one that left the blood soiled Europe with him was his oldest son Rabbi Naftali. He remarried and built up quite of an empire with a few thousand followers that reside mainly in the Borough Park section of Brooklyn NY, but also in London, Antwerp and Israel. He died in 2000 leaving his oldest son as the natural successor. From there things depend according to which side you listen too. Rabbi Shlomo had another younger son named Rabbi Ben Zion. Rabbi Naftoli did not have any boys but two girls and thus some favored his younger brother as successor but Rabbi Naftoli’s son in-laws thought otherwise. When Rabbi Naftoli died last week a bitter and ugly fight broke out between the family and followers. Right now, it seems as if Rabbi Ben Zion is winning, although, without the support of many natural followers who went to his counterpart Rabbi Ungar. None in their right mind could believe in any of those two claiming to be the rightful successor just by watching how badly they want it and how far they’ll go to be enthroned with the crown of the Bobov leadership. None in their right mind could believe in the two Satmar brothers who are fighting for the crown while their frail father is still alive. Look at all the other big and small sects and you’ll see the same ugly fights over and over again. Ger, Visnitz, Klausenburg, Belz, it seems that if you don’t fight you don’t exist. No wonder that Chassidim today are the most cynical people in the world, after all don’t we all believe in people that we don’t believe in. How can you believe in someone that doesn’t even believe in himself? What is happening is very simple, people realize that maybe the other fights that we read about in the olden days were just plain and simple the same fights that we see now only with different people involved. This can go up all the way to the fight between Moses who was the obvious leader and Korach who challenged his leadership. Who knows. Recently I came across a Yiddishe paper called “Transylvania Tzeitung” or something close to it. It is a paper from the early 1930’s that was published in Hungary before WWII it is just so amazing to read and observe the fights that went on then by people who were later revered to be the true Torah leaders. Just reading on what the Rebbe z”l did at that time or what people in his name did should give anyone second thoughts into his supposed holiness. I’ve been asked this week why I don’t at least leave the Chassidus I was raised in and just try to live as an own person. Many out there don’t really have any personal connection to a specific sect or Chassidus and they seem to have no problem with that. The truth is that for the state I’m in now belonging to the group is only a good thing. I see some of my friends who have officially disowned Satmar looking for schools that will take in their kids. I see them looking for a Shul to make a Bris or Kiddush for their newborns. I see them as rootless, and I don’t want to look like them. As much as I hate the self-righteousness of the two holy brothers (no, I’m not going to say which one I prefer and for what reason), I still know that I should use them more then they could ever use me, and I will. If my kids are going to stay here, they might as well have the benefits that come with belonging to a group even though there are some strings attached.

41 comments:

  1. Succession battles are inevitable, whether you're Moses, the kingdoms from solomen, the Bobover Rebbe Z"tl, the local Rabbi, or even the president of the united states!

    The only real question is if the succession battle is worth the leadership that you get out of it.

    Do you really think these occasional incidents overshadow any possible direction the administration can take us in?

    As for those rootless Jews who simply aren't tied down to a local group, to say they are rootless is a stretch. They aren't rooted to a leader, but they are rooted to Judaism, to being Jewish. It forces them to expand their notion of who is in their family. If I go to another city with a proper shul, I expect to be just as welcome to daven with them as I would at my home shul, not because I find their Rabbi/Rebbe is the best (whether I do or not) but because I am a Jew. Isn't that our real root?

    ReplyDelete
  2. When the outside world stops pounding on us, we pound on each other. This is so sad and so true. As soon a we have the luxury of peace "vayeshman Yeshurun vayivat" and the first thing we kick is the guy next to us. We need so much to bind us together, why do we rip ourselves apart?

    By the way, I'm not knocking Chassidus or Chassidim. I see the same stupid thing currently happening among frum Boy Scouts. Four years ago, 120 Scouts went to a National Jamboree as a Shomer Shabbat Contingent, and it was a big Kiddush Hashem. This year, it's all split up, fractionated, splintered.

    The small evil of individual egos creats the big evil that destroys communities.

    ReplyDelete
  3. I think you're projecting.

    "None in their right mind could believe in any of those two claiming to be the rightful successor just by watching how badly they want it and how far they’ll go to be enthroned with the crown of the Bobov leadership."

    come on. This is what is going on in Satmar, not Bobov. You do indeed have a miserable succession battle going on in Satmar between two people neither of whom seem worthy of being rebbe, because both seem incapable of putting the chassidim first.
    In bobov, it is not like this at all. Everyone always knew the rav hatzair would be the next rebbe. The sons inlaw have some followers who are making trouble, but there's no evidence that R Benzion wants it "so badly" - there's only evidence that a small group is making trouble.

    Bobov has always been a peaceful group and they did the hachtora early to try and prevent anything like what happened in Satmar from taking over. The powers that be in Bobov don't want a fight, and there won't be a prolonged one. The rav hatzair is not power-hungry - he's clearly the heir apparent (and it would do no one good for him to step aside for a different person whose followers are just troublemakers).

    Your post is just evidence that you may not be religious but you still have the ultimate allegiance - you know your chassidus (that you don't believe in) is the best...and when that's obviously not the case, you would like to spin the evidence to tell yourself that at least it's no worse than any other chassidus. What you are doing is seizing on any evidence to say "Bobov is just like Satmar." No. Satmar is full of hooligans and Bobov is not really like Satmar at all. The powers that be in Bobov are responsible, and their rank and file is mostly peaceful too. Satmar is cracking at the seams and Bobov is not, but you just want to be able to pretend that what's going on in satmar is representative of the state of chassidus generally when it's mostly just representative of the fact that satmar, from satmar, romania till the present, has been dominated by hooligans (R Yoilish used to complain all the time that he couldn't control them - whether he was too extremist or not he perceived hsi chassidim as going well beyond anything he desired)and now in addition it has no leadership.

    ReplyDelete
  4. And I'm not a Bobover by the way.

    I'm just someone whose noticed that you have every last prejudice of every satmar chossid, except that you happen not to believe in god (that's not been a requirement in satmar for a good few decades now, anyway).

    ReplyDelete
  5. SF 2001,
    We’re talking about Jews like me who don’t really believe in traditional Judaism yet still belong to a group.

    TW,
    I don’t think that fighting for power is something limited only to Frum people neither are fights between groups religious or other. It’s human nature and some like to exploit it.

    Anony,
    You clearly pull for BZ and I don’t know why you think he deserves it more then the lawful Yorshim of the previous Rebbe. The main difference that Bobov has to Satmar is that they were never trained to fight in the name of god and thus even the youngsters had a have a hard time doing what we do best. That does not mean however, that the fight is going to end or that it won’t last to the bitter end just like Satmar. Tell me though, what would have happened had Rabbi Ungar had the little bit of brain matter to walk in to Shul the day after with 50 Bucherim and 20 Kollel guys to stick up for him, would he not been there still to this day? Wouldn’t they fight in Shul just like we do? I strongly doubt it. Don’t tell me that this was the reason why he didn’t do it, because why did he go on his Shver’s place then? Obviously he is as power hungry as the other side.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Maybe it's time the Chassidic world appointed its Rebbes on merit, not on genes? Wouldn't there be less Chillul Hashem, and more non-Chassidim would respect them?

    TRK

    ReplyDelete
  7. I'm not up on the current crisis but do have fond memories of the Bobover rabbinic family. That said, I find these "succession battles" ridiculous. No one alive today will be the rebbe of Bobov or Satmar. Bobov and Satmar are "gone" as Jewish communities. So what we have here are growing communities in Brooklyn and Orange County. Why do "Satmar" or "Bobov" need to remain monolithic sects? Why one rebbe each? Who gets to decide who that rebbe is? Why don't the fans of Reb A go with Reb A and the fans of Reb B go with Reb B and call themselves "Hassidim of Reb A of Satmar or Hassidim of Reb B of Satmar?" And let their be mutual respect across all camps because, bottom-line, these are all good people trying to create good lives for themselves and their families?

    K"K ADMO"R Ben SHLIT"A

    ReplyDelete
  8. Anonymous says,
    "come on. This is what is going on in Satmar, not Bobov."

    You're right.
    What's going on in Satmar will not be happening in Bobov on the same grand scale.
    You know why though?
    Because Fighting is expensive.
    You need money to leave, build, and expand, and those stingy petty Galitziane have neither the means nor the will to dish out the dough the way their Hungarian brothers do.

    ReplyDelete
  9. TRK,
    This must be tough for a Rabbi’s kid to say…

    Ben,
    The main fight of course is the real estate. Who stays in control of the Buildings and thus keeps control of the Kehilah at large. Imagine someone having to build up a whole new Chassidus from scratch starting with a Shul, Mikveh, Schools system for boys and girls etc. etc. all over the world. For nor only is the fight a local one they have - on a smaller scale – branches in London, Antwerp, Bat-Yam and more. Whoever will stay with the Mosdos will be the winner by default. People who don’t feel strongly about either one of the self-anointed successors tend to stay put.

    I would think that this is the reason why Williamsburg by large is loyal to ZL and KJ is supportive of Aron T. It is only the troublemakers or the people who hated them before the fight that are openly against the one where they live. Imagine if London would have only one Shul, then there would most probably be only one clear winner over there too.

    HT,
    Even the Galitzyaners will open their pockets when it comes to a fight. Something tells me that the two Rebbes actually initiated this whole fight just to get money out of their Gevirim for their Mosdos. This could make a nice story in the Jewish Conspiracy theories weekly.

    ReplyDelete
  10. I think these are all good reasons to look at the effects of ego, and to inspect what it is in us all that creates strife like this. Un-love.
    Spacefalcon is right in that it's inevitable, until we understand that love doesn't leave room for jealousy and fear.
    We need to understand what it is that causes it all, the fear of our being separate from God.

    ReplyDelete
  11. The Rabbi's kid has a great point.
    Let's hope they do something similar with the Pope, I bet that will also degenerate into squabbling, though we might not get to hear about it.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Bobov is hardly short of money, HT.
    It won't happen because the rebbe (r. naftoli's father) really devoted himself to achdus and sholom and people are not prepared to utterly betray his legacy.

    ReplyDelete
  13. "You clearly pull for BZ and I don’t know why you think he deserves it more then the lawful Yorshim of the previous Rebbe. "

    Because both previous rebbes wanted him to succeed them.

    "Tell me though, what would have happened had Rabbi Ungar had the little bit of brain matter to walk in to Shul the day after with 50 Bucherim and 20 Kollel guys to stick up for him, would he not been there still to this day? Wouldn’t they fight in Shul just like we do? I strongly doubt it. Don’t tell me that this was the reason why he didn’t do it, because why did he go on his Shver’s place then? Obviously he is as power hungry as the other side."

    They kept him out.
    This was a wise thing to do - they didn't want what is now happening in satmar.
    Someone on R Ungar's side is powerhungry, but this is not evidence that r benzion is powerhungry. R Benzion has been the heir apparent all my life, and if he were to step down for a bunch of hooligans, the chassidus would not benefit. It would be a wrong thing to do. This is not comparable to satmar where there is real and lasting division among the chassidim; this is a case of a small group of troublemakers who *shouldn't* be rewarded for their efforts.

    ReplyDelete
  14. "The main difference that Bobov has to Satmar is that they were never trained to fight in the name of god and thus even the youngsters had a have a hard time doing what we do best."

    Yes that is right. They were raised to think that shalom is important and the Satmerer were not raised to think so. This is not a minor difference and it's the reason that bobov today is a respectable chassidus and satmar is full of unhappy and disaffected youth.

    "That does not mean however, that the fight is going to end or that it won’t last to the bitter end just like Satmar."

    of course it's going to end. Look, it's a shame this happened, and it probably wouldn't have happened a generation back. But what's going on in Bobov is still *nothing* like satmar, and it would have been handled differently if not for the fear of becoming like the satmar example.

    Satmar has its own problems that it would do well to face instead of pretending that every group is as corrupt and lacking in positive content as they are.

    ReplyDelete
  15. If I may be so rude as to refer to my post on the subject, the point I made is, if only these great Rabbis would open their mouths before they shuffle off on their mortal coils, these fights would not happen.

    ReplyDelete
  16. yeah frummer but in this case, they DID open their mouths.
    see the comments on your post

    ReplyDelete
  17. Hmm . . . Interesting http://yungerman.blogspot.com/

    ReplyDelete
  18. Anon, They didn't open them, not at all or not enough.

    Re Satmar, the fights which are happening now, will pale into insignificance when their Rebbe actually passes on.

    BTW, his sons know exactly what is going on. Many of the fights happen in front of their very eyes. They are as culpable as their chassidim. So none of this Rebbes good, chassidim bad rubbish.

    ReplyDelete
  19. "Anon, They didn't open them, not at all or not enough."

    they did. they just didn't predict that people would start saying that what matters is what the previous rebbe wanted, etc.

    this isnt like lubavitch that there was no clue what was wanted. this is a case where what USED to be sufficient (I.e. everyone on the planet knew that the rav hatzair was the designated successor) is no longer enough ...due to the Satmar example that leads hooligans to think that they can do what they want.

    ReplyDelete
  20. I was offered a part time job teaching English in a Satmarer Cheder. When I came in for the interview, one of the little mamzerim, who could not have been more than eight, and already bokki in chasidishe levush, recognized that I wasn't Satmar. He spit on me, whereupon several of the other little monkeys screamed in excitement.

    I didn't take the job.

    ReplyDelete
  21. I have been taking a Jewish history course and recently, our main topic was the Hassidim. It astonished me to learn how different the Hassidim of today are from the ones long ago.

    There were even attempts to excommunicate them (twice!). In the beginning, the Hassidim were the rebels! And now there are rebels within the rebels. Ironic, no?

    Of course, back then the leadership was based on merit. It was based on the charisma of the rabbi and how well he led the community. The rabbi of a community wouldn't be some kind of monarch. The Hassidim of the past also seemed much more occupied with joy and happiness. It is a miracle to see a religious person smile these days.

    Yet one thing the Hassidim have been able to hold onto is their sense of community. Something that few are willing to let go of. You are right to question leaving this cozy little foundation you have built for yourself. One simply cannot run off for his own selfish reasons when there is so much stability.

    And stability in this world is so fragile and so beautiful.

    No society is perfect, dear over-priced hat. Men, Jewish or goy, are greedy little monsters. Power struggles are certainly not a Hassidic thing (although they certainly should not be happening in the first place).

    With that said, (and I realize I was one of those who advised this in the past), there is no reason for you to leave this world of yours. You have found your niche, so to speak. Something few have managed to do in a lifetime. We all dream of a different life sometimes. I'm glad you realize that you like this closeness (even if there are strings attached).

    If you have ever read Yuri Slezkine's book The Jewish Century (don't, by the way, it's horrible), he discusses the topic of modernity and how Jews have been able to integrate into secular society because it has become a society of strangers. Yet that is the conflict of modernity because people don't always want to be strangers. The Hassidim certainly resisted this. And in a way, it helped them to survive through the centuries.

    I'm going to shutup now since I could go on and on...like I just did...anyways...have a good week.

    ReplyDelete
  22. ps. as a public service link this blog on you'r site

    http://vosizneias.blogspot.com/

    ReplyDelete
  23. Naomi, thanks, that was intersting, write some more!
    Usually I never read comments longer than about 3 paragraphs, unless they're really good, and try never to write that much. ;-)

    ReplyDelete
  24. Naomi, you are spot on when you say that the sense of community is the strength which holds chassidism together.
    What you have here, in Bobov and Satmer is what happens when communities become too large and lose that sense of togetherness.
    What you do have to keep in mind is that this infighting and power struggles are business and not personal.

    ReplyDelete
  25. People are getting too excited about bobov. A lot of groups split in europe too. so long as the split is relatively peaceful, it'll be fine, even if there's a split.

    ReplyDelete
  26. In the book Eyes to See (Eynayim Liros), Rabbi Schwartz notes that it is a shame that the non-Jews can organise legal systems for all their different groups, but we need a separate beis din for each sect.
    Here too, the goyim worked out how to solve succession issues. They call them elections. That way whoever wins does so without bloodshed or hatred. And the rebbes / politicians have to care about the chassidims / citizens interests and needs.
    Sad that in the religious world, we still do it the old bad way.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Shimon,

    (Elections)
    From what I have seen of the last several elections, I'm not sure that such a process would be any better for Chasidism overall.

    (Beis Din)
    It is true that goyim have a court system, but this court system is in no way as unified as some imagine. Many of the global issues we face today remain because courts in different countries cannot find agreement. Even within the US, jurisdictional disputes not only hinder court proceedings, but in many cases cause defendants' rights to be violated through the obfuscation of the 'double jeopardy' clause.

    That being said, the goyim don't have a Torah or a Shulchan Aruch, and that, if anything, should be able to unite Judaism under one Beis Din. The obstacles to that is, in my opinion, mammon and ga'avah.

    There are already Dinim in place that require the psak of one Beis Din to be honored by the others. I know that isn't worth he klaf it's written on, but it is there. Maybe if people quit shopping around for heterim every time they had 'issues' the various Batei Din could start to do things the same way. It's OUR fault, too.

    ReplyDelete
  28. We used to have a Sanhedrin. Why not now? Certainly the communication problems that existed post 70 AD, have been solved by high speed internet, faxes, and telephone.

    Now Moshe Rabienu knew that to keep civil order that there would have to be individual batei din in each and every city, so the litigants could find redress sooner than later. Can you imagine if every case had to go to the Supreme Court?

    Shoftim ve shotrim titen bechol shearecha.

    ReplyDelete
  29. How could there be elections? Who would decide who to put on the ticket?

    And anyway, us Chassidim consider our Rebbes to be very much like racehorses. Who sired them is of the utmost importance.

    ReplyDelete
  30. Shtreimel,

    As for your post, I am wondering whether the advantages of quitting don't outweight the disadvantages. And not being in Satmar anymore doesn't forcibly mean you're in nothing and have to find another shul for each simcha. You can just join somewhere where there is a nice community that accepts not fully observant Jews. That way, you can actually have a TV etc, but you still have a warm, loving community.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Call me meshugeh but I think that Reb Streimel's issues with the kehillah are a but deeper than just watching TV.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Shtreimel, I don't understand Satmar (now or in the past) firsthand, so I'm trying to paint a picture from people's stories.

    If the core of your problem is that Satmar has become "dysfunctional" as the result of the succession issues, what's to stop one/you from moving on to another chassidishe community?

    IMHO, "disowning" Satmar, then looking for a shul is not the smart way of going about this, but what if you were to go out of your way to meet people who are active in other chassiduses, talk with them, ask what they like and don't like, get invited to their homes and shuls, then have a discussion with your family one what would work best. (I know, I know, you father/father-in-law will might throw a fit, but what the heck.)

    And Jewropean, I think that most "observant" Jews would resent the implication that Satmar is somehow more fully observant than them.

    ReplyDelete
  33. Jewropean,

    If I leave already, I will leave the whole thing. It will be as hard (!) to leave the community as far as my family and friends are concerned, as it would be leaving altogether. Both are not options unless I divorce.

    SL,
    Absolutely

    Ben,
    The core of my problem is GOD not Satmar.

    ReplyDelete
  34. 1) I didn't claim TV was the main thing Shtreimel is missing.
    2) I didn't claim Satmar was more fully observant.
    3) But I did imply Satmar is more isolated whereas other communities tolerate elements from the secular to a much larger degree.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Shtreimel, IMHO, scratch the surface, and most "religious" people do what they do because of what their family, friends and neighbors do and expect from them. Even when they invoke "God, they're doing so "kahavei yachol" - metaphorically - rather than literally. "The Original" even wrote about this in one of his posts.

    Ben

    ReplyDelete
  36. Ben,
    I humbly disagree. Most people I know believe out of ignorance yet still believe in god. They were taught to fear god and they fear him immensely. They would never be desecrate Shabbos even in the confinement of their own homes and even when no one is around. Yes, a lot would forget to daven at times or maybe do some other Aveirah but you would never see them doing the big ones, like Shabbos, Chazer, Yom Kipur etc.

    People who do not believe in god and in the Mesorah from Sinai till today wouldn’t care to fast on Yom Kipur, would they? Those people would cut a piece from the toilet paper roll even on Shabbos. Why not?

    I know that there are some people who do not believe, at least not in the religious aspect of Judaism, yet they still continue to act according to the Taryag Mitsvos and beyond. Those people are beyond my understanding. Why would someone chose to go hungry for 26 hours just because someone made things up 3500 years ago? Why would someone not put the lights on his bedroom when there is no chance of being caught just because Moses decided? I just do not get it. Then again, it is not the only thing I don’t get, but I would love for anyone who could explain it to me to come forward.

    ReplyDelete
  37. Hello Shtreimel,

    Most people I know believe out of ignorance yet still believe in god. They were taught to fear god and they fear him immensely. They would never be desecrate Shabbos even in the confinement of their own homes and even when no one is around.

    In school they taught us about the "mirror image fallacy," that people often mistakenly believe that everyone else thinks just like them. I may be guilty of this.


    Yes, a lot would forget to daven at times or maybe do some other Aveirah but you would never see them doing the big ones, like Shabbos, Chazer, Yom Kipur etc.

    Interesting mix of sins. Violating Shabbat is punishable by stoning, yet there are many other rules which carry this penalty. Likewise Yom Kipur, which is punishable by "karet," being cut off from your people and eating pork, which is one "laav" ("no-no," punishable by whipping) among many. How do we know that these (plus sex) are the "big ones" to God if not for our friends and neighbors?

    People who do not believe in god and in the Mesorah from Sinai till today wouldn’t care to fast on Yom Kipur, would they?

    Yes, they would. Go to ujc.org/njps and read up on the National Jewish Population Study. A high percentage of Jews observe Pesah and Yom Kipur, even without literal belief in God. Liberal Judaism, especially Reform and Reconstruction are for the most part not based on a literal understanding of God, yet people do take rituals upon themselves. I have not read these books, but I'm told that they give a good introduction to the variations in Jewish thought (including liberal) about God and religion: "Sacred Fragments" by Neil Gillman and "Judaism as a Civilization" by Mordecai Kaplan.

    I know that there are some people who do not believe, at least not in the religious aspect of Judaism, yet they still continue to act according to the Taryag Mitsvos and beyond. Those people are beyond my understanding. Why would someone chose to go hungry for 26 hours just because someone made things up 3500 years ago? Why would someone not put the lights on his bedroom when there is no chance of being caught just because Moses decided? I just do not get it. Then again, it is not the only thing I don’t get, but I would love for anyone who could explain it to me to come forward.

    People engage in rituals for lots of reasons. Consider the various things people do at baseball games; the chants, the hand gestures, the foods, the music that's played.

    Jews keep traditions because they are "connecting" with the rituals and history of their people, either because it makes them feel good or because they feel obligated. On the negative side, they do it because of fear of what their family and neighbors will do to them if they don't. That behavior will carry over into one's private sphere, because a. people have been taught that even to think is bad and b. people don't want to go "schizo" and c. it's not worth the risk. I choose not to eat pork, as it's a long standing Jewish tradition and I want to do my part to protect some of it. I also feel that it's not a bad thing to set some limits on yourself, to say, I can do what I want to this planet and its resources, but will not. I (and lots of non-believing Jews) fast on Yom Kipur, again, because its a tradition. I also spend the day at a great shul, where the atmosphere is a mix of joyful and serious, introspective and optimistic, and at no time, am I made to feel like a bad person.

    Hag kasher vesameah, a happy Pesah,

    Ben

    ReplyDelete
  38. Shtreimel, what I left out was that I'm coming to the conclusion that people who feel good about their family, cohorts and community do & expect follow the rituals and people who feel like they've gotten raw deal want to chuck it.

    ...which makes me empathize more with the wife's reaction in a discussion I'm having in another forum.

    ReplyDelete
  39. Every Chassidus big or small where the Rebeb dies leaving more than one male relative, sons, sons-in-law or brothers or whoever will end up in a fight. These people have all been brought up to think that they are someone special and that the world owes rthem. Who would want to give that up?

    ReplyDelete
  40. And what do my fellow Jewish brothers have to say about Satmir never paying for the steel on Bedford ave. A Jewish steel contractor who developed so many Yeshivas and Shuls suffered so much because of the split. Amazingly the same contractor got burned again by Satmir on the Wythe Ave school in Williamsburgh.
    During the Wythe project, the steel contractor made an offer to supply and install stairs and railing for the building free of charge if he would be paid. Satmirs representatives agreed, the stairs and railing were built but the iron worker never got paid.
    What kind of example does the Chasiduth set when the children learn torah in a school that was not paid for. A basic rule for any religion should be that if a man works he should be paid!!

    ReplyDelete

If you HAVE to post anonymously please sign off with a nickname. Thanks.